Just one more reason the smart money is in installing PV systems for no other reason than it is 'the right thing to do' and forget about bowing and scraping to the utilities for permission.
Anyone remember "Don't ask, Don't Tell, Just press sell".
Gorilla Solar anyone?
Should be don't ask,don't tell,just install and use the utility as nothing but a backup.
Do Micro Grids.
Do AC Coupling or whatever but stop the madness of "grid tie"
From my experience it only encourages more wasteful use of power anyway.
Not to mention it's just a worthless pile of glass and aluminum when the inevitable loss of grid power happens
Like being all happy and proud ever since you found a way to put more gasoline into a gas tank full of holes.
"Some day it will be affordable and part of the construction process and the world will be a better place."
Some day it will be affordable??
Just how low do you want to go?
Is free low enough?
I have neighbors who think nothing of buying a $60,000 vehicle (Escalade which is a lousy pickup frame with a Pimps Penthouse tacked on top for example that in just a few years is resting upside down in a wrecking yard) and then they tell me that my $15,000 PV system that wipes out all my monthly electrical expenses and will for the next 40+ years is way too expensive. They can't afford it.
PV is now far more practical and affordable than the majority of the junk people buy all the time.
It's long past time to drop this 'affordability' nonsense and realize your "and the world will be a better place" is a nonstarter until we do that.
Thanks Ga SO
Personally I think as PV and BOS's gets cheaper and cheaper and installer/designers begin to remove the fog of typical 'grid tie' that now clouds their creative view,we may look back on this era and view how we now do PV as antique and quaint as a Model T or an old fabric covered biplane.
We currently have an entire grab bag of technology and hardware to achieve far more reliable,practical,cost effective systems and that includes doing Micro Grids and stand alone systems.
Many of the impediments to application of these techniques is wrapped up in the bureaucratic and regulatory momentum of the current paradigm. A paradigm that in most cases simply rewards more "glass on a roof" ,doing more to reward the rich tax phobic than it does to actually creating a sustainable and truly productive energy system .
Let's just hope enough of us can overcome this situation and move in a new direction that will actually make PV and renewable's the great products we know they can be.
With enough effort and obvious success we may even begin to hear something other than the monotony of "Solyndra just proves the greens are losers" from our current crop of so called conservative 'science deniers.
Well. Maybe that is just wishful thinking
I would readily agree that the current high speed rail projects proposed in California and in other states are at best 'boondoggles and a waste of resources'.
I would also add though that Musk's proposal is more a bandage on an arterial hemorrhage.
Musk's efforts and wealth should be concentrated on trying in some way to get more of us to realize that all that we call 'reality' exists only because of one thing: ancient stored sunshine better known as crude oil.
Suppose I forgot.
America is now the new Saudi Arabia.
Crank up your SUV
FOOL speed ahead.
Of course we all know that all Ponzi schemes appear to be creating vast dividends and making its investors wealthy,fat and happy.
That is until the scheme is revealed as the fraud it is and there is no more input to keep the fraud going,
It would not make anyone happy to speed blindly from LA to San Francisco in Musk's invention only to find when they arrive there is nothing to eat.
Fertilizer,pesticides,herbicides and massive transport and process infrastructure requires a massive input of liquid stored sunshine.
Electrons no matter their source are no substitute.
P J ORourke wrote a book titled "DON'T VOTE, IT JUST ENCOURAGES THEM"
The new book should be titled " DON'T BUILD ANYTHING THAT CAN'T BE USED WHEN THE WELL RUNS DRY. IT ONLY ENCOURAGES THEM TO THINK THIS CRUDE OIL PONZI SCHEME WILL LAST FOREVER".
Just one more of many examples of why for years I have not been a fan of grid tie design
Use the grid as nothing more than a backup and forget about the 'trojan horse' that is a utilities 'alms to poor suckers' who seek and then accept the restrictions utilities use all the time to maintain their dominance over power production.
"Oh but I spin my meter backwards and get a rebate"
BTW these folks can get rid of the batteries and still do their grid tie if they want to
I've done it with Outback and others several times and involves just a few unique methods
Limits them to daytime operation and attention to loads and irradiance levels when they desire off grid backup but at least their investment is not sitting idle
Posted by anonymous below..........................
"First the utility must know who has these systems in terms of line repair. In a normal power system, one pulls the circuit breakers on the generator side and one is safe. If there is a backup system or solar, then one must isolate the line break on both sides to make a repair to the line or do hot repairs. For residential neighborhoods this adds cost, time and risk to repairs. "
I would also remain anonymous as you know little of anything about how the Outback systems are installed and used and the entire 'protects the lineman' strawman is silly on its face. Any lineman who does not first assume all lines are hot and double checking before touching anything,and then also clamping all phases to ground before working is a candidate for the Darwin Award anyway. Enough already.
A very big issue is that with all the endless code requirements for something that should be as simple as heating water,costs just skyrocket
I have regularly seen systems installed where the ROI was decades based on the low cost of natural gas or electricity vs the solar thermal
In almost all cases the thermal systems were forced to follow onerous rules and regs that relegated them to more of a "Rube Goldberg" science project.
Even PV has many regs and codes enforced that upon close unbiased inspection prove to be useless at best. PV should be no more complicated to install than a modem.
Most any honest professional in PV or Solar Thermal knows these facts but they are like a cork flowing with the current and have little choice in the matter and just go along to get along.
Two giant 'red flags' in this proposal.
One would be that any revenue generated from the bonds must be completely removed from any and all connections to anything on Wall Street.
Also stiff and enforceable penalties of imprisonment and financial ruin should be put in place for anyone trying to 'game' the system. You know full well the financial 'vultures' will strip this bond proposal down to the bone while small investors have their pockets picked.
When Matt Taibi described Goldman Sachs as "a vampire squid clamped to the face of the financial system, sucking out its blood", he clearly described all that Wall St has now become.
Secondly there should be a requirement that no renewable energy funds are expended on any project until we as a country make at least a tepid attempt at basic conservation techniques.
With current available technology most every home and business in this country squanders the vast majority of the energy produced.
Putting in place rules of even average requirements of upgrading and retrofitting of physical plant on all levels would reap many multiples of benefit above and beyond any renewable energy project.
Unfortunately these changes are not 'sexy and green' in most peoples minds.
Let's first get us up to early 20th century standards of efficiency before dumping 21st century energy into the voracious black hole of energy consumption that is America.
Like almost all of these protests I would be surprised if even %1 of the protesters had made even a modest effort in either radically reducing their electric power usage (done fairly easily and at modest cost) or purchasing and using the very technologies they want to advance. All the protests in the world are for naught if those who consume the dirty power do nothing more than cry about it.
"In regions dependent on fossil fuels for electricity generation (i.e., the entire U.S.), power plants will shut down, or “trip,” within 24 hours (or less) without continuous fuel supply."
Dealing with Zombies if this happens will be the least of your worries.
You should have included...............
Far too few people have any idea that all, yes all nuclear power plants in the US are nothing more than a controlled meltdown.
No nuclear power plant can generate its own power. Ironic but true.
They only generate when they are connected to the grid.
Kill the grid and a diesel backup must start very quickly or the core will meltdown and you have another Chernobyl or Fukushima. Only difference is over 100+ of them and scattered all around the country.
At best the power plants have diesel fuel for only 72 hours.
If you are talking about a real nationwide 'zombie apocalypse' for lack of a better term then supplying diesel fuel will be out of the question.
The cores can and will melt down with all the attendant destruction and death this implies.
Anytime you hear some misinformed sycophant touting the virtues of nuclear power keep this scenario in mind.
Stan Curlee's comments on Germany appear at first blush to have some merit
Germany having such a poor solar resource and wind power that we know varies greatly each hour,would seem to pose a real problem for grid stability
Where does the extra backup power come from when it's cloudy and calm?
I think this would be a great discussion to have as it applies across all grid systems around the world
What is the real truth of this?
As for RPS and the current incentive programs in California?
For the most part these programs are designed to dump lots of money into a select group of well healed hands while ensuring the status quo so far as any real and substantive necessary changes to the fundamental way power is produced and used.
Example would be dumping solar PV into a wasteful grid where a large percentage of power is used to heat water and where a low cost solar thermal system would actually achieve far more benefit.
Many more examples if one takes time to study it
There's a real debate that we need
As someone who has been intimately involved in designing and promoting PV technology since 1976,I have had to watch with dismay and sadness as more and more PV was installed in ever larger arrays and then tied to a wasteful and 19th century generation model known as utility power. DG is no different than local food production vs food shipped from thousands of miles away or living in a country that manufactures every form of weapons of death and destruction but cannot or will not produce its own shoes or much else for that matter. Roof top solar with some form of storage or at the very least simple and low cost AC Coupling should be seen as much a no-brainer as demanding real freedom and being willing to fight for it at the same time you dress up as a founding father and make your claim of being 'a real patriot'.
Roof top solar is a key part of true freedom and patriotism.
Roof top solar also helps one avoid becoming a part of a total rejection of innovation,creative design and 21st century living standards. Translation: Accepting nuclear power as our best option. .