Renewable Energy Solar Energy Wind Energy Geothermal Energy Bioenergy Hydropower
 

Electric Vehicles: No House of Cards

By Tom Konrad, Contributor
January 11, 2012   |   16 Comments

Do you like this opinion & commentary?

Email   Bookmark Bookmark   Print   Feed   Share
 

The information and views expressed in this article are those of the author and not necessarily those of RenewableEnergyWorld.com or the companies that advertise on its Web site and other publications.

16 Reader Comments
Comment
1 of 16
January 12, 2012
In the conclusion the author asks if the EV is the answer to our car culture woes (paraphrased on my part)and that is the root of the matter.

We are ingrained with consumption. Our watchwords seem to be more is better. The ease with which a person can obtain a hollow yet recognizable status symbol like a certain kind of car (ideas sold to us but that's another slippery slope)'fuels' this false sense of accomplishment.

Our entire government whirls and sputters and pukes out laws to sustain this lunacy. It's no small wonder the up and coming EV industry would have to endure these over-simplified and incomplete calculations.

The author of those criticisms assumes the role of the nanny tucking a child in bed and reassuring her wards that they are snug and safe from the hurricane outside.
Comment
2 of 16
January 12, 2012
Gasoline is over $3.00 a gallon or $240.00 a barrel. There are many costs that need to be added besides the cost of crude.

Most people don't drive over 50 miles per day, making a plug hybrid a better solution.
Comment
3 of 16
January 13, 2012
...and if a household has adopted solar power, that wipes out the cost to charge an EV, but then you have a whole 'nother set of calculations to factor in.

I'm not yet a big EV fan but I am tired of the BS information (bribes) that seem to permeate our decision-makers.
Comment
4 of 16
January 13, 2012
My mistake, there are 42 gallons in a barrel.
Comment
5 of 16
January 13, 2012
Oil continues to increase in price, and decrease in supply. Wind and solar continue to increase in supply, and decease in price.Every major auto company in the world is rushing to release an eV or two, as fast as possible. Can you really doubt that this is the future of personal transportation? Rolls Royce has announced they are going electric. Not because there customers give a sh__ about the price of gas. eV's are just better.M.Benz thinks in 5 years they will be largely an eV company. Remember guys; we didn't leave the stone age because we ran out of rocks. We found something better.
Comment
6 of 16
January 14, 2012
One can get a residential PV system installed for as low as $4.50/watt before rebates. Each watt of PV will produce about 1.5 kWh / year in a reasonably sunny area - adjust accordingly.

Assume that you buy a 1000W system for $4500 that lasts 20 years and produces 30,000 kWh. EPA estimates are around 3 mi / kWh, so that will get you 90,000 miles of emissions free driving, or $0.05 / mile. That's pretty cheap, and that's before any tax credits or rebates! Get the 30% tax credit and your cost goes down to $0.03 / mile.

Or let's say you drive a 30 mpg car instead for 90,000 miles and gas costs $3.50 / gallon. That will cost you $10,500 or $0.12 / mile.

Conclusion: Solar powered car is much cheaper to fuel than a gas powered vehicle - and a lot cleaner, too.

PS: YMMV!

PPS: Yes - ignoring tax credits you have to pay a bit more for an electric or plug-in hybrid. But these costs will come down as volume climb. Be glad that some of us are early adopters helping to drive the revolution!
Comment
7 of 16
January 14, 2012
With your permission 'drees' I'd like to reprint a portion of your post. The part where you do your miles per Kw is a good conversational launch point. I'm beginning a new career (my third and final chapter) in solar sales and I am very excited conceptually.You pointed out that you are an early adopter and I need to set my sights on the mainstream and knuckle-draggers.

Your careful assessment of pre-tax credit costs for solar is also an ever-evolving factor just as the applicable technologies for solar itself. There are cars that run bits of their electrical systems with an integral solar panel. How long before the whole car is run by a panel and its paint job???
Comment
8 of 16
January 14, 2012
@Paulsmoney - feel free to use my example and adjust to see fit. They are just back-of-the-envelope numbers to get in the ballpark.

As far as running EVs off solar panels embedded into the paint or otherwise - it's not going to happen. There simply isn't enough surface area on the car and solar isn't efficient enough. You're much better mounting that solar panel in the sun and grid-tying it.
Comment
9 of 16
January 15, 2012
The EV track we are presented, IE these concept vehicles will fail!Heres why, The KISS concept is totally missing.To make this work. Lets start with the most popular vehicle in America,the regular standard pickup truck.Heres how,the assembly line pickup would be minus engine/tranny/fuel sys/cooling sys/exhaust sys/ elec charging sys/pumps,belts, hoses, etc etc.. Now we have somewhat of a rolling chassis/or platform to work with.The power plant would consist of "two" 30hp DC motors paired with a gearbox (2 inputs 1 output shaft).A proven old school 3 speed manual tranny should be quite sufficent to transfer that power to the axle/wheel an tire assy.theres plenty a room for AGM batteries, 6to8 in front, a dozen or more in the cargo/bed area.wing an sliding rear glass windows for ventilation,an elec ceramic heater block mounted befor the blower motor,a dashpot for a throttle, and of course safety, DC fuses for normal safe operation and collision electrical automatic disconnects.Manual brakes an steering worked just fine,refering back to the old heavy weight vehicles the 1930s thru the 60s,elec windows an power locks can remain on assy line.I have passengered in a 1998 ford ranger total elec truck,powerplant 30hp DC motor, 4 speed manual trans, with lead acid batteries.Wow i was impressed! The acceleration would pretty much set your back firm against the seat, the noise factor was almost nil, tire noise only.This was a summer afternoon 45 min ride, start, stop, cruise, there was no air conditioning package under the hood,the coolness of this ride was mind boggeling.The missing cooling radiator/gas engine, and hot exhaust piping,created a phenomenon of coolness,I would have never believed,till i witnessed this first hand,unbelievable.PS: this is not a novelty vehicle, its a daily driver.The word hybrid is bad, it goes along with regenerative braking, what a waste, Too much over-engineering!!! Overkill. Ya need more range, add more batteries!
Comment
10 of 16
January 15, 2012
bill5711, on a rant, continued from above post.The idea of trying to EV with such a small frame,starts this concept at a loss.The posting above ref:solar panels to run EVs might not be too far fetched,heres why.I call this the Mushroom Effect> feed ya sh#% an keep ya in the Dark. NASA i'm sure is using 40%, to 50% effeciency pv panels, while us earthlings struggle to get 16% to tops 18%, at best. Also dont think for a moment that space station is using some locale store bought batteries.. They got the stuff!! But we are Mushrooms! and we aint gittn it!Nothin but the best with our tax $$$.. Oh, let no one tell you we dont have the "tech",its all there!! I'm sure there are many other forces "holding back" the EVs.. Hummm? the list of hinders would be toooooo long for this post.. thanks bill5711
Comment
11 of 16
January 16, 2012
GM had a video at CES last year with some interesting concepts. I like the idea of doing away with traffic lights:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vUJHDW07gQ4
Comment
12 of 16
January 18, 2012
dear fireohenergy, You may have noticed that HALF of all new power generation is wind. And ZERO% is nuke. Tell you anything?
The Brazilians, South Koreans, Argentines, and ALL Eoro's with a coast line have huge off-shore plans. Expect more and more transpo. to go eV. Expect more and more ePower to be wind. Don't hold your breath on that your guess on reactors, OR ANY OTHER STYLE to get any real money or development. There will always be a few nut-bags that think wind and solar won't work....well what's happening?
Comment
13 of 16
January 18, 2012
All the comments so far have missed the bigger picture.
Mr Peterson and his criticism of the EV have little if anything to do with the technology or costs or benefits or any of those easily debated points.

Mr Peterson,I would bet my life,will if asked admit that he considers himself a CONservative. A CONservative with all that that entails including following the 'conservative bible' with all the sins listed and spelled out.

CONservatives first are critical of EV's because those folks who they label 'liberals' actually like them and support them.
Most who they call liberals also support clean air and water and one can only dream the CONservatives will stop breathing and drinking clean water to prove my point :)

Just as a true CONservative will rail against abortion as being a sin and then fully support mass murder in the name of national security you must realize it's not the murder they object too. They object first to women having freedom to choose. We know how much true conservatives hate freedom or any form of democracy (they illustrate their hatred on a daily basis in spite of their rhetoric) Why would a CONservative not object to having the ability to be free of oil?

No Mr Peterson you don't actually have any real opinion on EV's one way or the other. You just feel compelled to talk like a fool (you're in good company based on the line up of potential Republican moron's now running to serve as stooges for international capitalists)and denigrate a technology you know nothing about. I would not be surprised if you told me the Volt uses the same batteries found in your wifes vibrator that you would never admit she uses. Being a hypocrite is in the DNA of all CONservatives. There is help for this malady though. It involves getting out of that box that is built for you by the same type of folks who gave us Stalin,Mussolini,Hitler and on and on.

WRATH OF KHAN

Perhaps Mr Peterson could star in LAUGH AT CON

NOT! CON's are by nature far too sad.
Comment
14 of 16
January 18, 2012
Part of my earlier point was simply that the graft that governs our country wears both conservative and liberal hats. I don't know what powers their dildos late at night but during business hours, when they're boinking us, the only thing that powers legislators is greed.

If proponents of EVs can pony up enough money to sway subsidies their way, we might see an increase in possibilities. But the wheels of government need greasing and historically we know grease is a petroleum industry exclusive...hence no mass transit of note, twenty-first century inter- continental rail shipping systems etc, etc, etc
Comment
15 of 16
January 18, 2012
we didn't leave the stone age because we ran out of stones. we found something better. we are doing it again. to date there are more progressives buying eV's. they are better at seeing the future and refusing to be mired in the past. (ie,CONserving the old way) but in the near future even republiCONs will figure it out. for the betterment of the eV movement, let's hope the president is re-elected, and eV's and renewables get all the gov't assistance that the gov't takes from the oil cartel. WE WILL GET WHAT WE SUBSIDIZE. take a billion or two from oil subsidy and make twice as many lithium polymer batteries. here's hoping for a cleaner future.
No image available
Comment
16 of 16
Anonymous
March 8, 2012
While I think EV's will eventually be cost effective for most drivers at some point, they're definitely not there yet. EV development, production, sales, and operation are heavily subsidized in the US. And these subsidies muddy the cost comparison picture with gasoline vehicles. Not to mention the fact that much of the retail sales price of a gallon of gasoline is federal and state taxes.

Since gasoline sales are heavily taxed by the state and federal governments, and account for a large amount of their annual revenues, what will these governments do to replace those billions of dollars each year if we switch to EV's?

There's no conspiracy against EV's. It's just the free market at work. With the economic laws of supply and demand, if there was a large scale switch away from gasoline to EV's, then the market cost of electricity would rise and the market cost of gasoline would fall. That would not help the cost metrics behind EV's.
Add Your Comment

Registered users, please make sure to Sign-In. We and others want to know your ideas and opinions. If you are not yet Registered -- it's quick and easy. Just click below.
Thanks!

Register Now   Sign-In

Tom Konrad

View Tom Konrad's Profile
About: Tom Konrad is a financial analyst, freelance writer, and policy wonk specializing in renewable energy and energy efficiency. He manages green stock market portf... more »

Advertise With Us

FRONIUS USA LLC  Solar Electronics Division Helios Solar Works Kipp & Zonen Solar Energy International (SEI) Prudent Living, Inc. GoGreenSolar.com Yingli Green Energy Americas, Inc.
World's #1 Renewable Energy Network
PennWell
Renewable Energy World Magazine International Renewable Energy World Conference & Expo North America Renewable Energy World Conference & Expo Europe Renewable Energy World Conference & Expo Asia Renewable Energy World Conference & Expo India Renewable Energy World Conference & Expo Africa
RenewableEnergyWorld.com Solar Power Gen Conference & Expo Hydro Review Magazine Hydro Review World Magazine
HydroVision International HydroVision Brazil HydroVision India HydroVision Russia
Twitter Facebook Linked In RSS Feeds e-Newsletters