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Solar Power: A Gift from Space

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17 Reader Comments
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Comment
1 of 17
Anonymous
August 18, 2009
Some corrections:
1) The NYU report claims natural gas costs are 3.5 cents/kWh not the 1.35 value given in the table.

2) When the author states that solar energy is the basis of "all of our power sources except nuclear and geothermal" he has neglected gravitational forces which account for hydroelectric and tidal sources.

3) The statement "The problem is that energy needs are unevenly distributed and usually peak at night" depends on your location. Heating needs usually peak at night but commercial and industrial energy usage typically peaks in the daytime and A/C demand often accounts for much of the peaking electrical power needs.

4) CHP is an underutilized strategy in today's marketplace, but the 85% efficiency the author uses neglects the percentage of the time that the heat produced can be put to no productive use. The 15-20 ton/acre value for miscanthus production does not seem to be, as stated in the article, for degraded farm land and neglects the energy costs of fertilizer, harvesting, and transportation. Thus the advantage of biomass over CSP is somewhat overstated.

Steven
Comment
2 of 17
August 19, 2009
Steven, you were quite right to point out gravitational energy but hydro electric is from indirect solar energy, in my book.

If you are assuming hydro is gained from gravitational potential energy (GPE) you must look at the energy balance - that water was once at, or around ,sea level and has gained GPE to get into the clouds so there is actually no net gain in GPE when the water returns to the sea. The more important energy transfer involved is the thermal latent heat of evaporation which is derived from solar energy, mostly. Without solar energy to give us our weather patterns (wind), the clouds would not form or move?

Regards, RAB
Comment
3 of 17
August 19, 2009
More corrections in addition to the ones from Steven:

5) "If we look at land use of some real projects now on the drawing boards we find that the latest photovoltaic, parabolic and tower projects all use about 5-6 acres per peak MW. The Saguaro 1 MW parabolic trough plant near Phoenix for example, generates 2000 MWh of electricity annually, using 15.8 acres."

The numbers in your example shows 15.8 acres per peak MW, not 5-6. But that may have something to do with the next item. Why didn't you follow your own advice and give acres per annual GWh, instead of acres per MWp?
Comment
4 of 17
August 19, 2009
6) "The specifications for the Saguaro solar plant illustrate another messy thing about the specifications on solar power. The spec shows a capacity factor of 23% now, but with the 6-hour storage added the capacity factor jumps to 40%. This seems to be common practice. When storage is added the capacity factor spec goes up apparently to indicate the % of time that power is available. Power is sold by the kilowatt-hour, so perhaps it would be better if we stopped talking about Watts and used GWh/yr instead."

Yes, CSP is more messy than PV. No, it does not indicate the % of time that power is available. It will still show how much electricity in MWh will be produced annually compared with how much electricity would be generated by a plant running at peak capacity 24h x 365d.

A 1 MWp plant running 24h x 365d would generate 8760 MWh annually. At the current 23% capacity factor, that's 2000 MWh annually. At 40% capacity factor, it will be 3500 Wh annually. That is because they will be adding solar collectors, increasing the solar energy collected and convertible to electricity, (from 2000 MWh to 3500 MWh) while not increasing the capacity of the steam generator (1 MW). This means at noon the collector will be collecting solar power at more than 1 MW, but only 1 MW will be turned into electricity by the steam generator. The rest will be stored for later use.

While as consumer, MWh is much more relevant to me, utilities and ISOs need to know both MW and MWh. I think showing both W(peak) and W(average) could be helpful, but no doubt people will still be confused.
Comment
5 of 17
August 19, 2009
"Solar thermal is often supplemented by natural gas."

That's true, because natural gas is cheap. But you could supplement the solar with biomass instead if you're willing to pay more.


"A mass-produced solar thermal-CHP system sized for large homes or apartments could be much more cost effective than the typical overpriced home photovoltaic installation we often see."

That could be true for commercial and industrial buildings or even residential communities with district heating, but personally for an individual house, I'd much rather wash my fixed PV array twice a year than have to maintain a steam generator and a solar tracker. Not sure I'd want to try to make telephone calls with a steam generator next to the house either.
Comment
6 of 17
August 19, 2009
If I see one more myth about coal being 1.2 cents per kWh, I may regrow my hair on my bald head. In the three States where coal provides over 90% of electricity, delivered kwh costs are: Kentucky 4.63 cents/kwh, West Virginia 5.13 cents per kWh and Wyoming 4.98 cents per kWh. Now if the grandfathered, polluting coal plants still allowed to generate after passage of the Clean Air Act were actually shut down and newer coal plants were built
to generate the same amount of power, add another 1.8 cents per kWh. If the coal industry were no longer allowed to blow up mountain tops and leave their wastes in our rivers, stream, farmland and schools, add another 1.72 cents per kWh. If the coal industry were not allowed to emit mercury, a heavy metal that interferes with human and animal immune systems, add another 1.02 cent per kWh, and if required technology to reduce just the proven carcinogens from entering our air and water, add another 1.23 cents per kWh. When you add this aggregate 5.77 cents per kWh over Kentucky's 4.98 cents per kWh, you result in 10.75 cents per kWh and that's not including carbon sequestration or charging for the real cost of using 40 percent of our nation's surface water for electric power generation..
Comment
7 of 17
August 19, 2009
Hard numbers. Direct normal sunlight (dish et al.) in Colorado 5.5 kWh/m2/day average or 2000 kWh/m2/year (1.25 bbl./m2/year oil equivalent), half that in Seattle. At 80% thermal efficiency sunlight is worth one barrel of oil per square meter per year. Land density at 25% delivers 1000 bbl/m2/acre/year equivalent.

Solar is cheaper than coal even if coal were delivered for free due to the cost of new coal burners.
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Comment
8 of 17
Anonymous
August 19, 2009
Scott:
Regarding your comment #5. It isn't a myth that coal is extremely cheap, which is why much of the developing world in depending on it for new production facilities. The data in the NYU study that was quoted here derive from a 2005 EIA report and include only the cost for fuel operations and maintenance. Note that this neglects the capital costs for building the plant and for any utility profits, etc. Your unsourced data seems to be US retail prices, which are naturally higher for this model of pricing would also lead to higher prices for all the other generating methods as well. Would you care to provide us with the reference for these data?

The environmental costs that you cite don't seem to influence utilities worldwide because they don't have to be paid by the producers. Thus, these data are not especially relevant in determining technology adoption rates. This may be unfortunate, but (alas) it is certainly no myth.
Steven
Comment
9 of 17
August 19, 2009
The sun might give one kWh of energy from one square metre (per day) or one kW of power from one square metre, it which case in the Sahara with about 6 peak hours it would give about 6kWh (per day). Which is it. People talking about power and energy should be scrupulous about using the terms correctly. They have very different meanings.
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Comment
10 of 17
Anonymous
August 19, 2009
http://rredc.nrel.gov/solar/old_data/nsrdb/redbook/atlas/

7.5 kWh/m2/day annual average = 2737 kWh/m2/year
Two Axis Tracking Concentrator SE California

9.0 kWh/m2/day annual average
Two Axis Tracking Flat Plate SE California

Oil 1610 kWh/bbl.
Comment
11 of 17
What this article demonstrates (give or take the odd quibble) is what a low grade resource solar power actually is.

With minerals, the cost of extraction is usually directly related to the grade of the ore. The higher the grade (usable mineral per cubic metre of earth) the cheaper the extraction cost. Black coal is a very high grade resource in terms of energy units per cubic metre so even though it is vilified for wasting two thirds of the energy when coverted to electricity it is still the cheapest form of electricity generation (externalities not included).

Because solar is such a low grade resource it will always struggle to compete with coal or uranium. We might improve the solar conversion techniques but we cannot do anything about the solar concentration per unit area of collection surface. It will always need to be hugh and therefore expensive.
Comment
12 of 17
August 19, 2009
Why couldn't you retain heated water by covering or sinking it and using it as an energy source at night?

In an alternative, why not use waste water to grow something that might shade the evaporation pond?

In addition, it is my understanding there are renewable sources of biomass in the southwest, such as mesquite pods and coppice pruning that do not require water or fertilizer inputs.

There used to be a bounty on juniper in the Oregon desert. Juniper can send roots down far enough to tap aquifers, as can some kinds of pine. Personally I love juniper. First peoples made medicine from it, while western people made gin.

Why people want to plant things as biomass sources that require outside inputs is just mystifying to me.

Agave is an increasing resource in Mexico. Everybody knows about tequila, but that is not the only thing you can make from agave. It is an increasingly popular low-glycemic alternative to the use of corrupt subsidized forms of sugar. Increasing numbers of conscientious U.S. people boycott beet sugar from genetically modified plants. Agave requires minimal inputs from outside the local area where it is grown.

Anybody complaining about corruption can stop buying subsidized sugar products. One's health would likely improve as a result. One of the genes frequently inserted in genetically modified plants is a digestive inhibitor. Offshore research is finding deleterious effects from these inhibitors in certain percentages of the population. These genes are now escaping to other species from the GM beets.

Grasses are not my favorite garden plant. At least diversifying from them by interplanting taller species would decrease the water inputs required for them. Adding pulses and beans would fix some nitrogen for the hungry grasses. A grass monoculture is about as boring, ugly, and resource-hungry as I can think of. I don't get why anybody likes this.
Comment
13 of 17
August 19, 2009
Solar economics -- Direct normal peak irradiation is 0.85 kW/m2. Concentrator cost is between $100 and $200 per m2. At 80% collection efficiency (dish ~ 680 kW/m2) that comes to $147 to $294 per peak kW. Adjusting for 25% solar capacity factor that would be $588 to $1176 per kW at 100%. A new coal boiler cost about $1000/kW(thermal). If coal utilization capacity is 90% then that comes to $1111/kW(t) at 100%. So, solar boilers and coal boilers cost about the same. O&M for coal costs more than O&M for solar.
Comment
14 of 17
Doug if you are looking at long run margin cost you need to consider the life cycle of the equipment. A coal plant can last 40 to 50 years so the capital cost is amortised over a long period. I'm not sure how long CSP plants will last.

Are you sure about the CSP capital costs? I have an IEA report which puts the overnight capital cost for a coal plant (including generators) at around US$1,300/kW and a CSP plant (including generators) at US$2,775/kW.
Comment
15 of 17
August 19, 2009
If using internal rate of return and net present value then anything beyond 25 years has little present value. A solar plant should be durable for at least 40 years with maintenance at 2% to 3% per year (of capital cost). Coal needs boiler replacements every 7 years or so. Most of the cost of coal is the burner, boiler, and handling equipment. The turbine might only be $250/kW. And there is the interconnecting substation.

CSP is a loaded term and indicates old government designs. Most of that is from the 1980s. In terms of energy, troughs are the most expensive, followed by heliostat systems, then dishes. Balance of plant for CSP is expensive due to poor utilization. More advanced systems are gas fired with solar supplements for full utilization of balance of plant, like BrightSource. They claim heliostat systems at $150/m2, so does eSolar. I believe those aspirational goals are achievable when analyzing materials, tooling, and production costs.
Comment
16 of 17
April 17, 2010
As all too usual, in this article the terms "Power" and "Energy" are confused. The basic unit of measure of Quantity of Energy is the Joule, which is defined as one Newton (about 1/10 of a kgm force) pushing something for a distance of 1 metre. The time taken to do this defines the Power - or Rate of usage/transfer of the energy. If the above object is pushed over the one metre, in one second, for instance, then the pusher - or puller - is supplying energy at the rate of 1 Watt - 1 Joule per second - during that time. Until these confusions and vaguaries are cleared-up
confusion must reign, with people going-away with an "I can't understand this stuff" head-condition, and wishing to forget all about it !!
I am of the opinion that it is just such stuff - coupled with business and political intrigue - which has lead to the squandering of 10 digit numbers of pounds sterling - and the equivalent quantity of CO2 - in the pursuit of "clean energy" programs such as "windfarms" - the design of which is so hopelessly out of touch with physical reality that during their entire life-span, they supply only just over half the energy required to replace them. This is not funny.
Comment
17 of 17
April 17, 2010
Likewise MWh means megawatts of heat. "Electricity" - electrical energy - would be megawatt-hour, MW-hr. i.e. so many megawatts for so many hours, multiply the two and we have "megawatt-hours" of Energy.
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Thomas Blakeslee

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About: Thomas R Blakeslee’s books have been published in nine different languages. After serving for three years in the U.S. Navy, he earned a degree from CalTech in P... more »

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