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US House and Senate Move Forward on American Recovery and Reinvestment Act

By Graham Jesmer, Staff Writer
January 28, 2009   |   11 Comments
Stimulus package in discussion includes favorable provisions for renewable energy industry

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"The House bill is the one that has everyone talking. Most bills would allow companies to take the ITC in lieu of the PTC. The House bill however gives the option to trade those credits in as grants from DOE."

-- Greg Jenner, Partner, Stoel Rives
11 Reader Comments
Comment
1 of 11
January 29, 2009
Nick, the man's name was Reagan. If you can't get 10 words into a post without making such a mistake, don't post. Half of your response is about concentrating solar power (CSP), which is mentioned nowhere in the article above. And if you want to see excellent, made-in-the-US-of-A technology for concentrating solar power, check out SolFocus (www.solfocus.com).
Comment
2 of 11
January 29, 2009
Badly spent money.

Oil is at $40 or so a barrel dropping from $140 + per barrel last year. Natural Gas has had even a steeper decline.

Excluding Wind and Geothermal, Alternative Energies couldn't compete at $140 per barrel. Now they are just big time money losers with no prospects to be affordable for years.

Solar PV still comes in at over $.19 per kWh for utility scale and $.30 to $.60 for home roof top installs while competing against Natural Gas at $.06 and Coal at $.045 per kWh.

In the current economic environment, does anyone feel the need to pay 3 to 10 times the cost of generating power power for green alternatives?
Comment
3 of 11
January 30, 2009
Jim

How long will petrol stay at $40 and Natural gas at $.06 at, Coal at $.045 per kWh?

a) no one knows
b) 5 years
c) 15 years
d) forever

What you are ignoring in your deliberations is that by investing in renewables the US Government is not only helping to bring the prices down, but also making new jobs, creating know-how, reducing US imports (long term when transport start shifting to electricity), etc. etc.

In long term (more than 30 years) the only viable energy sources are those that do not depend on finite fuels or fuels at all. Thus investing in renewables now gives more market share in the future.

Oil Peak, Coal Peak and Gas Peak - all are inevitable - no one knows when the production of Oil, Gas or Coal will be unable to grow with the speed the demand grows. We dont have the data. So we must assume that they will come earlier than we expect. That means investing in no-fuel technologies - building know-how, training people, building factories etc.
Comment
4 of 11
January 30, 2009
Gore wrote of Oil running out and Rivers "Boiling Over" by the year 2000. Peak Oil is a scare tactic. If anyone bothered to use common sense they would realize that when Exploration reaches out 20+ years, service well drilling reaches out 10 (capped for future production), infastructure (service pipeline)less then that. Just because I have only 1 years supply of Food either preserved or on the Hoof, Doesn't mean after one year I'll Starve. Just because I've explored and found enough Deer and Rabbit to put my mind at ease that I'll have food for 30 days doesn't mean I should listen to all the DOOMSDAYERS that say we've only confirmed a 30 day food supply, STARVATION IS INEVITABLE.
If the Government targeted ALL THE MONEY to Private - Home based power production, Conservation, Efficiency the Homes would be worth more (people wouldn't be equity inverted correcting Debt to Asset Ratios), banks would be stable (jewel asset backed rather then Toxic Asset overextended), contracters, electritions, plumbers, and installers would be put to work as well as the companies that supply them, Home Owners would have their Monthly outlay for energy reduced and live in better conditions (windows, heat systems, insulation, etc.), That's how REAL STIMULUS happens not by pushing money at "Universities" to think about the "problem" .
I'd rather trust my neighbor to spend his $1 then the Government w/ my neighbors $10. "Covet not thy Neighbors Goods" is at the root of the old accusation "Godless Commies".
Comment
5 of 11
January 30, 2009
A couple of comments:

1. Human evolved out of the stone age not because we ran out of stone.
2. In terms of meeting our energy needs, currently, about 40-50% of energy was contributed from coal. US is rich in coal resources. However, there are two issues: (a). Coal is precious feedstock for chemical industry. Burning them off is too wasteful. (b). Guess where all these Hg in fish came from? Coal burning plants.
3. I trust CEO of corporations spending the money to a point. Please note, majority of CEO's are not looking beyond one quarter. Some of these CEO's may be visionaries. Stock price (and/or shareholders) will not allow our CEO's to act with long-term vision in mind.
Comment
6 of 11
January 30, 2009
There is no question that the availability of these funds will stimulate the economies of many industries and communities. What I do question however, is the quality and sustainaibility of the projects themselves as well as the oversight for those obtaining and using the funds. People are funny when it comes to money... Ethical use of the funds is a concern.
Comment
7 of 11
January 30, 2009
The Earth is warming...this is undisputable. The fact that the burning of hydrocarbon-based fuels is contributing to and hastening the pace of global warming is, at the very least, probable. Even if you don't believe it, you must admit it is at least possible. If it's possible that global warming can have devastating effects on humanity and the planet, and it's possible that we are contributing to the calamity and have the power to change it, why would we not try to be proactive? Why not pursue alternatives?
The price of oil is too volitile to truly predict these days. We import oil whose supply (and therefore price) is dictated by those who sell it. If we move towards an alternative, they may simply adjust the price down to keep our interest. We need an independent energy source and the quickest way to get it is to get the ball rolling with renewables. Drilling here and drilling now will provide us with enough oil to drop the prices at the pump by a few pennies by 2030 (DOE). At the same time, we will be spending more and more to continue to bandaid the emmission issues.
Electric cars and plugin hybrids represent a viable technology that is here today and will soon be widely available. A solar PV system on your roof and a plugin car in your garage and you won't have to use gas 90% of the time. Why not promote that?
The big oil companies are pursuing renewable energy development as much or more than anyone else. They're not stupid. They will already be on board when this industry is huge.

Many people were against the horseless carriage at first as well.
Comment
8 of 11
January 30, 2009
Jim - do you really think oil will stay at 40,00 ?? Worldwide oil has peaked - May 05. Look at the data. Oil will stay at 40.00 if and only if China and India decide to STOP all economic development and regress 50 years.

Is that your bet ?? NOt a good one, in my opinion.
Comment
9 of 11
January 30, 2009
I believe that price of gas is fundamentally more important than the price of oil, outside of powering current transport technologies. So forget $40 and $140 for a minute. In the US and EU gas price is the key driver of the marginal cost of electricity which drives earnings and sets the volume of govt subsidies required to assist renewables in achieving price parity.

I except a link between the prices of oil and gas currently. I have examined the current planned capacity expansions of CCGT units globally over a 10yr time horizon and the matching this against 'peak gas' in both Canada and the UK, and rising internal demand in the key exporting countries (Russia, Iran, and Nigeria). I conclude that demand will quadruple and exportable supply fall by 25%. Factor in the cost and more importantly the time lag in developing new nuclear (see Finland EPR delayed by 38months and €bn over budget) and carbon regulation forcing the closure or expensive retro fitting of existing coal supply and suddenly there's an array of evidence for supporting a substantial rise in electricity prices forcing even current renewable energy technologies to instant price parity.

In my view Obama should be focusing on transmission. That is now the key, the market and manufacturers have proved adept at refining technology, albeit slowly. Put people to work in turning every home into a power station and reversing the power network from being a conveyor of centralised power to the extremities to a means of allowing each home and remote windy/sunny hillside to extract revenue by virtue of location and capital investment in equipment.
Comment
10 of 11
January 30, 2009
MIT openly posts some research results. It's looking to me as if Chinese manufacturers have people sitting on the net fishing for anything they can use to improve what they do. I am interested in hearing from anybody who knows about Suntech's application of peripheral technology on some solar units, if anybody has put these in or observed them in Europe.

There are impediments for some U.S. manufacturers' applying this information as quickly as the Chinese, who are dollar-rich, but at least one U.S. company beat expectations for the last quarter.

We need renewable energy credits (REC's) set at a floating rate to reflect market conditions and needs. If schools have good locations for small plants, we should come up with ways for schools to serve their neighborhoods by providing and being compensated for surplus generation from their plants. Maybe a local credit union or some other business already invested in the neighborhood could build the generation and deal with the accounting and maintenance. That is how Oregon governments have gotten around not needing their own tax credit. They have let for-profits have the credit for putting the unit on and maintaining it, or some such joint-venturish thing (the Chinese love joint ventures).

I agree that if an existing utilities sees this as a burden rather than an opportunity, they are not the appropriate ones to carry it through. We need brave souls such as Dennis Kucinich, in Cleveland, to explain to existing utilities why we should allow people ways to provide for themselves and for others from their surplus and why they should not have to pay for greedy-CEO syndrome.

Ratepayers can put in their own plants and not contribute to the grid. That may already be happening while companies hang onto every dollar they can get from every belching old plant and get their legislators to help them continue living in the manner to which they have become accustomed.
Comment
11 of 11
February 1, 2009
REC Group, the world's largest manufacturer of solar grade silicon, is lobbying Congress for stimulus funds to build a "clean coal" power plant adjacent to their Butte, Montana silicon refinery.
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Graham Jesmer

View Graham Jesmer's Profile
About: I am currently a third year Law Student at Vermont Law School where I work as a Research Associate at the Institute for Energy and the Environment writing and r... more »

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