Renewable Energy Solar Energy Wind Energy Geothermal Energy Bioenergy Hydropower
 

Newark, Delaware Tests Vehicle-to-Grid Technology

By Elizabeth Boyle, University of Delaware
January 30, 2009   |   12 Comments

Do you like this news?

Email   Bookmark Bookmark   Print   Feed   Share
 
"If electric vehicles charged at night with wind power, the grid operator could use the energy in the batteries, when vehicles aren't needed for driving and are plugged in, to help maintain grid reliability."

-- Willett Kempton, Associate Professor of Marine Policy, University of Delaware
12 Reader Comments
Comment
1 of 12
January 30, 2009
How does the system ensure that the vehicle is fully charged when the owner needs to drive it?

It seems to me that it would be more efficient to have a stationary battery bank for dealing with fluctuating supply and demand rather than having it in a vehicle, wasting energy to drive it around.
Comment
2 of 12
January 30, 2009
Keith:

It seems like solving that problem would just be a matter of designing a program so that the driver could set the battery to only discharge a certain percentage of its power, depending on how far the driver intends to travel that day. A full battery probably won't be necessary for short trips and everyday commutes.
Comment
3 of 12
January 31, 2009
Well, it shouldn't be too difficult to provide a cool looking software interface in which the vehicle owner/driver could put conditions like "do whatever grid regulation you want, as long as my car is charged at xx in the morning" or something like that.

If the vehicle gets an IP adress or some mobile phone number, you could send your vehicle an email/text message at which time you want it charged?

Any software experts to comment here?
Comment
4 of 12
February 1, 2009
I don't mean to be selfish but if I spent a great deal of money on a vehicle, I would not want its battery endangered in any way by delivering power to a grid unless I was sure to receive good renumeration for that purpose. Batteries have a definite number of cycles to their lives and the cost of providing grid power from ones car might prove more costly to the owner than expected, including perhaps a fast decline in power storage capacity over time.

The government has been giving away fistfuls of our tax money to help banks but I feel that battery ownership of a paid for vehicle is completely under the jurisdiction of the individual owner and not subject to outside and seemingly un-intelligent control. Battery energy from any owned vehicle should be compared to ownership of blood from any individual whenever a donation is requested.

It seems unwise for any utility to expect future plug-in car owners to play a part in maintaining their electric grid system. The Emperor was wearing no clothes but it took a little boy to say so. Perhaps my feelings are not shared with others but at least I am being honest.

adrianakau2aol.com
Comment
5 of 12
February 4, 2009
Hi Adrian,

of course no-one can force you to feed electricity back into the system. But there can be incentives for controlling the flow to the car, to make it cheaper at a time the utility has more power available, and there can be incentives to also feed back power in times of need. How does 2000$ / kWh sound? For a kWh you bought for some (tens of) cents? IIRC, those were the price levels during the California power crunch a few years back.
Jakob Østergaard of DTU (Denmark) had an interesting calculation (back of an envelope, but still...), which showed that by having the car available for system services (not necessarily being used, just being available) could under NordPool current pricing pay for the leasing rate of the car - including battery!

Another mitigating factor is that (that is also an answer to you, Keith and Andrew), you would probably only use the upper 10 or 20% for grid services. It's the deep discharge which severely impacts your battery lifetime (with LiIons at least), not some twinkling at nearly fully charged.

Gregor
Comment
6 of 12
February 4, 2009
Why not have a feed in tariff for V2G "upload" of electricity? Here in Ontario, we currently earn 42 cents a kWh for solar generated electricity that is supplied under the RESOP (renewable energy standard offer program).
EV owners who have signed a deal with the LDC could earn a premium for their EV stored electricity, offsetting the potential for a shortened lifecycle of the battteries, while they also offset the surge in spot market pricing .
Comment
7 of 12
February 4, 2009
Power is power and appropriate electrical motors and meters don't care where it's generated from, but the type of use of that power as supplied by batteries is of concerned, I would surmise, by the battery manufacture's warranty policies. Would grid-connected batteries used for private use as motive power in automobiles become classified as commercial usage by battery manufactures when used to supply grid power and cause manufacture's warranty values to be more restrictive and shortened over non-grid private usages? I am sure the answer will come from battery manufactures, but the number of a battery's cycle-life could be accelerated short of a customer's anticipated service life when grid-connected.
Comment
8 of 12
February 4, 2009
The demo video is great (although could use a little less jargon). It's a good example of hardware, software and energy working together. A great start and something that packaged well can motivate consumers.

Seeing the meter spinning backwards is always a crowd-pleaser.
Comment
9 of 12
February 5, 2009
Why in the world do the batteries need to be on wheels??? For $2K per KWH, I'll go fill up my garage with batteries and let my local electric grid have at it!
Comment
10 of 12
February 5, 2009
Fill up your garage with batteries, put up a wind turbine and a some solar PVs-----and you will have no need for the local electric grid.
Comment
11 of 12
February 5, 2009
--------"How does the system ensure that the vehicle is fully charged when the owner needs to drive it?"-------

LOL, it doesn't---in fact, in view of Murphy's Law, it seems more likely to me that it is much more likely that a little pop up will tell you, "Your Vehicle is low on power and shutting down now. You should plug into AC power or switch batteries in 30 seconds to avoid shut down."-----probably as soon as you get about 3 miles from home.
Comment
12 of 12
February 5, 2009
Hybrids charge as they go and can even be used to feed in with their gas engines if needed, right? So why not use hybrids as micro-grid generators that can be rolled to where the need is? If somebody figures out how to make good fuel from kudzu, mesquite pods, cellulosic, or algae, then we can modify engines to use that if the time comes.

In the meantime, if a line goes down, separate it until it is fixed, and roll around to connect what isn't broken, at least for essential functions. We already have rolling stock that could be retrofitted to do this. Rather than building hydrogen stations, we may come to have battery-switching stations, if batteries come down in price as more are used and needed.
Add Your Comment

Registered users, please make sure to Sign-In. We and others want to know your ideas and opinions. If you are not yet Registered -- it's quick and easy. Just click below.
Thanks!

Register Now   Sign-In

Advertise With Us

LORD Corporation Comment:Visions Solar Power International 2011 Texas Solar Energy Society Schneider Electric North American Board of Certified Energy Practitioners Apricus, Inc.
World's #1 Renewable Energy Network
PennWell
Renewable Energy World Magazine North America Renewable Energy World Magazine International Renewable Energy World Conference & Expo North America Renewable Energy World Conference & Expo Europe Renewable Energy World Conference & Expo Asia Renewable Energy World Conference & Expo India Renewable Energy World Conference & Expo Africa
RenewableEnergyWorld.com Photovoltaics World Magazine Solar Power Gen Conference & Expo Hydro Review Magazine Hydro Review World Magazine
HydroVision International HydroVision Brazil HydroVision India HydroVision Russia
Twitter Facebook Linked In RSS Feeds e-Newsletters