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Report: Hydrogen-based Vehicle Research Initiative is Making Progress

April 2, 2008   |   11 Comments

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"For the industry to transition to a hydrogen-based vehicle used on a broad scale, the program will have to continue to be well-planned and managed with foresight."

-- Craig Marks, Committee Chair, National Research Council
11 Reader Comments
Comment
1 of 11
April 2, 2008
This story was supposed to have been posted yesterday.
Comment
2 of 11
April 2, 2008
You are right, the "hydrogen civilization" is a delusion, at best
Comment
3 of 11
Researchers should stop wasting money on hydrogen research and put all their efforts into improved batteries and ultracapacitors.

Even if the storage and cost problems could be solved, there's still that 30% loss of energy in the creation of H2. The real loss is more like 50%.
Comment
4 of 11
April 3, 2008
I've heard that conversion efficiency argument for a decade of more now. It's just as true now as then and just as irrelevant. We need mobile power fuels. Battery storage is not and probably never be adequate to operate a tractor trailer or a 5000 ton freighter. There are two reasons why it's irrelevant, the first is because we need it, and the second is that renewable energy sources like a wind farm or an OTEC plant will always have excess capacity.

I like the idea of floating wind generators that use excess capacity to produce H2 and store it in the bottom of its buoyancy tank and use it to generate power when the wind doesn't blow.
Comment
5 of 11
April 4, 2008
I've looked thru the Freedom Car site and can see who the automakers are but who are the 'energy companies'? Are they gasoline producers? Does anyone in this group not have a vested interest against batteries in EV's?
They are going to pour all this money and time into this project just so they can 'decide' by 2015 if fuel cells are even possible? Does anyone else smell a B.S. stalling tactic?
Comment
6 of 11
April 4, 2008
Hydrogen doesn't look very promising. Cars based on that tech often have a cruising range under 150 miles with an added fuel tank.

However, hydrogen could be useful if we ever got the cost of electricity to a dirt cheap level - $.02 per kwh? Then the conversion issue would be moderated by the extreme low cost of power. Since we do not appear that era yet, hydrogen should not be taken seriously.
Comment
7 of 11
April 4, 2008
I don't think electric semi's are going to happen. What will happen is bio-diesel from algae. It won't be made in ponds, but in closed bio-reactors. Once this technology ramps up, we can tell the Arabs where to stick their oil. Technology and determination will save the day.
Comment
8 of 11
April 4, 2008
I am not totally convinced by the "hydrogen economy", but conversion efficiency of energy to hydrogen is not the issue. Every energy source you can imagine will suffer conversion losses. The only reason oil is such a great fuel is that the conversion was all done for us millions of years ago. Unfortunately it will run out just as sure as anything else we use and dont replace.

If the hydrogen economy is to work, we have to learn how to produce it sustainably where it is needed, or transport it cheaply and most of the related issues are political and social, not technical.
Comment
9 of 11
April 5, 2008
Hydrogen is an energy "carrier" just as batteries are. The difference between the two is the time that the energy can be stored without unacceptable losses. Batteries are a short term storage device, this includes ultracapacitors. Hydrogen has long term storage advantages.
The amount of energy stored is also a consideration. You can store more energy cheaply using hydrogen than you can using batteries.
There are advantages to using each in the area they they are best suited.
It all comes down to energy density and the ability to hold a charge.
Comment
10 of 11
April 6, 2008
At least seven more years stalling , after 30 years of stalling. The hydrogen car isn't going to happen in time to save us ( as the report implies) and the lost hydrogen would wreck the ozone layer anyway.

Its a way for Detroit to carry on business as usual instead of doing 1. 2X efficient cars 2. fuel/electric hybrid.

Transport future will probably be segmented: shorter distances electric/battery, longer distances liquid fuel ( ethanol?) fuel cell/electric, planes bio jet-a substitute, Heavy trucks biodiesel then ethanol/fuel cell. So lets focus on battery/capacitor storage , liquid fuel cells, and reversible fuel cells ( can be driven as battery as well) and stop wasting money on hydrogen.
Comment
11 of 11
August 24, 2009
People are on the lookout for economic signs. Economic signs aren't normally paid attention to when things are boom, but are under the microscope when bust. DP, or Gross Domestic Product is a biggie. Home sales and house prices are also important, so are unemployment rates – and their declines have all slowed. Since most manufacturing (or production) has dipped, unemployment will continue to rise. (That's called Okun's Law, but its veracity is disputed.) Not many businesses have extra cash, or people for that matter. Most experts are predicting a recovery that will start soon, and complete by 2011. Despite the economic signs that the decline has slowed, many are out of work, and few cash loans can be had.
Read more:
http://personalmoneystore.com/cash-advance/cash-loan/
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