But what would need to happen in order for this fictitious scenario to become a reality? The obvious answer lies in government subsidies, which are now looking grim in the aftermath of Solyndra’s bankruptcy.
Beyond the hopes of tax grants and a national renewable standard, what can the power industry do to see solar implemented into utilities’ portfolios on a larger scale? Hamm said that collaboration between utilities and solar businesses is key and then introduced six executives of municipal or public utilities to discuss solar integration at the utility level.
Randall Mehrberg, president of PSEG Energy Holdings, said that financial decisions to install solar projects have to compete with another price tag most U.S. utilities are currently facing – the cost required to retire or retrofit a large percentage of their coal-fired fleets. “Cost, at the end of the day, is what haunts us all.”
While some utilities may turn to solar power as filler to replace pre-existing coal-fired generation, Mehrberg said that most will turn to “low cost, prevalent natural gas.”
Electricity costs are bound to escalate over the next 20 years, said James Rogers, chairman, president and CEO of Duke Energy. This will happen as a result of a large amount of coal generation being turned over and necessary improvements to grid reliability. However, solar will become increasingly attractive to utilities as the cost of solar power continues to descend, Rogers said.
Utilities must be instrumental in educating their customers on the value of solar – that it’s worth paying a few extra cents each bill, said Larry Weiss, CEO of Austin Energy. “I continue to be dumbfounded by consumers who want to have their cake and eat it too. They have to be willing to pay more for renewables.”
While the inherent cost of solar can be disconcerting, utilities must recognize that solar power presents an element of cost avoidance not found in traditional forms of generation, said Doyle Beneby, president and CEO of CPS Energy. “For every 1 MW of solar I install, I don’t have to worry about the Clean Air Mercury Rule, or a host of other EPA regulations.”
CPS Energy is in the process of retiring 850 MW of unscrubbed coal, Beneby said, some of that generation will be replaced with solar power.
When looking long-term, utilities should also consider that the U.S. may eventually implement a carbon tax, said Armando Olivera, president and CEO of Florida Power & Light Company. “The U.S. is the only major country not imputing the cost of carbon. It will eventually be taken into consideration.”
Rogers of Duke Energy echoed his thoughts. “By investing in solar, you’re putting a hedge on against what a lot of us think is inevitable: carbon regulation.”
For now, the addition of renewable energy into most utilities’ portfolios will be incremental, said Weiss of Austin Energy. “We cannot switch all our generation overnight to solar and wind. But solar is a small part of the equation.”
To see the full round-table, a fascinating discussion, watch the video below.
The information and views expressed in this blog post are solely those of the author and not necessarily those of RenewableEnergyWorld.com or
the companies that advertise on this Web site and other publications. This blog was posted directly by the author and was not reviewed for accuracy,
spelling or grammar.
Hopefully utility scale solar becomes "cost competitive" to these energy monsters long after the greater part of American rooftops have consumer owned PV units in place. They can use it for the coming data transmission power consumption demands.
Being in the solar business for over 15 years, I was told that the cost of one dollar per watt would be the magic number for grid parity and utilities would embrace solar on a large scale. Well, we achieved it and the utility greed and BS continues. Health and air quality issues remain, massive profits remain and us, the ratepayer keeps Paying more. A lack of leadership remains too, via our ridiculous two party system which keeps business as usual and thwarts change. Solar and biofuel to electricity generation is our last great hope for our world, simple as that. Go China PV and Go EPEC Biofuels, on your own without the incentives of government support, just by your value to all.
One more thing, if we get rid of republicans across the board, maybe we can get things done. Always remember our enemy is the 1% and the devil is our "rapture" friends. There, I said devil...
We have a similar lack of vision over here in the UK where the coalition has pulled the rug out from all the big Solar PV parks under pressure from the Utility cartel.
Devil indeed.
Comment
5 of 22
Anonymous
October 26, 2011
More industry over hype and grren cult gods over an alterntive energy form that is like nature inefficient unpredictable; requires radiation; two chemical reactions ( most carbon by products) in an enclosed environment following the laws of thermal dyanamics which adds to he equation; in a ozone atmosphere which adds more instability and adds VOC'S to the low level ozone which in itsleg the majorcause of global warming
The earth is one giant eco system or heat sink whcih requies efficient use of land which man does not; and man creates UHI (all man made structures) including the new commercial solar plants and roof top instalaltions.
According to maps publised by soalr and used by the hyped up solar indsutry most of the US averages 3-5 to 5 hrs of good sun.
$1 per watt is still $1000 per kw but not one yet mentions the numerous over head costs which vary.
I love to ask people about the sudsidies which is actually a cahnge in the tax alw since 1986 and centers around depreciation and depletion expeses vs income; if changed they still receive it over a different time frame
Keep in mind it affects your 401k; roths; Ira and retirements programs
There are a couple of reasons to retrofit coal plants into a Hybrid Hydrocarbon/Concentrated Solar Power plant first before adding PV panels. First, the steam generated by CSP is compatible with coal fired turbines and would save costs associated with tearing down the existing structure. Second, keeping coal or natural gas in reserves will help with ensuring power reliability and help prevent losses associated with buying outside power.
Furthermore, I believe that shareholders will find value in this type of investment.
Perhaps customers should also be offered an exclusive dividend paying premium shares which pays back more than common shares instead of being asked to pay a little more on their utility bill to add solar power.
Another thing to keep in mind, the job losses from reduced coal production is greater than the job gains from renewable energy.
So interesting that the view of the Ute's could envision solar adoption with incentives from the govt, while the average person, however willing, may try their best to get some financial aid wherever they may find it. Incentive, or 'reward' programs require certain compliances that raise system cost, sometimes doubling it, making those same incentives flat, or invisible to the net consumer when cost of the programs is considered.
It is a late realization that it may seem more logical to have carbon production penalty costs cover the solar energy production incentives only WHEN the Ute's have their corporate fingers lined up for the grab. It must be pointed out, even again, that solar energy is distributed to all freely, untill the sky becomes too hazy or dark to receive it..
Also pointed is that the 'rich', gary's and others, find job loss in coal mining more serious than environment and health quality loss. So tiny and myopic your vision. These same people in government also say with certainty, that health care cost is not the responsibility of the government. Profitting from sickness is the rule of the age on so many levels. This is soooo broken.
I welcome a far more peaceful life, free of economic stresses imposed by the mad scramble for energy and 'growth' which is a contrived illusion at best. The current mad 'hustle' we have in the USA now is the pale of possible realization, if we may choose to accept it.
I Would like to know how potential job losses in coal mining are measured against jobs created within the sustainable sector, lets see your equation.................
Comment
9 of 22
Anonymous
October 26, 2011
Additional comments; EPA regulations from a government agency that has no clue and has trouble meeting its objectives. OSHA is more important
Carbon regulations the evil talk of Al Gore and his religious followers; carbon is required by the earth for life to exist; if you want to fix a price on carbon just think of the over 6000 items that contain carbon by products which now includes all of alternative power sources including solar; wind; and battery storage; along ethanol another form of gasoline.
If we learn how to recycle the the coal exhaust and solid waste in oil refining in addition to our tires and asphalt uses of the waste products along with clean up.
The answesr now being worked on is better efficiency of the boilers along with improved filtration
'One more thing, if we get rid of republicans across the board, maybe we can get things done.'
Sam your dead on here.
Except remember that the word Republican describes not only a party but a mindset as well.
Down through the history of mankind there has always been two distinct mindsets of the human species.
One has always been the primitive,fear based,intellectually bankrupt mindset.
Example:
Conservanon the Neanderthal sits in his cave and observes a sabre tooth tiger just beyond the entrance.
He knows that if he goes beyond the cave walls and manages to kill the tiger and eat it he will have a better diet than the slimy grubs that litter the floor of the cave. Little effort to keep eating the grubs,no danger of being killed by the little critters,unlike the tiger.He decides to take the safe but less nutritious path.
The other mindset, displayed far less often than the likes of Conservanon, takes a far different view.
Lib Lib the Enlightened sees the saber tooth tiger. Knows he could have meat as well as warm blankets. Sees the possibility of using the teeth as implements and tools.Studies the tigers movements to see if he can safely dispatch the animal and still survive.
Problem is Conservanon believes in sky spirits and listens to his version of a pastor. Forces Lib Lib and his kind to sit in the corner and shut up. Seems Conservanon inherited lots of spiked clubs and Lib Lib took his threats too seriously. Also couldn't get enough of the other cave dwellers to take away his clubs.
Conservanon and many of his kind starved. Lib Lib and his kind also perished due to the overwhelming force of Conservanon.
Conservanon's decedents now run Fox Channel,vote straight Republican and burn incense at the altar of The Bush Crime Family.
Lib Libs decedents now drive Prius's,eat organic,love solar power and vote for anyone who is a good liar.
Conclusion?
No hope. All is lost. Resistance is futile.
Now don't forget to vote.
Hawaii could be hitting the mark within seven years. The big island already uses 42% renewable energy (http://www.westhawaiitoday.com/sections/news/local-news/renewable-power-production-big-island.html ). For the mainland, their number is conservative. Just extrapolating current trends, my numbers would probably put that about 2025 (http://2greenenergy.com/wanted-people/16351/ ). That is assuming that distributed solar on rooftops or a new solar electric utility doesn't eat their lunch before that.
We are at a tipping point whereas the corrupt capitalist system via the 2 party control of lawmakers are really one in the same. We must choose one side to get it done which is why I believe the republicans need to be voted out completely. It is mind boggling that bush and Cheney are not in jail or any bankers or wall streeters either. We are the people who are supposed to be represented by who we vote into congress. Special interests feed our lawmakers to fund their campaigns and become employees of oil and coal industries. We are so broken that solar and biofuels will never see the light of day unless oil and coal profits, by law can be diverted toward clean technologies and I don't mean clean coal.
To "anonymous" about CO2- The sudden excess in natural evolutionary time is part of the problem. CO2 is rapidly building at the same time we are decimating the vegetative life that would naturally expand to use it, and balance the world environment.
Also, CO2 production is merely a partial but accompanying guage of a plethora of highly toxic pollution that accompany's "burn-tec" energy production. You wouldn't allow your neighbor to burn their waste in your home environment, but you allow it to be done by the Ute's and auto companies because you choose to deny the usurped trade value as visible.
At best, we must consider "burn-tec" as an interim measure, only acceptable untill more benign solar methods can be adopted. The question is now, "Why Wait".
Comment
14 of 22
Anonymous
October 26, 2011
If we get ride of all CO2 and all forms of carbon which is the goal what will we have left; oxygen; hydrogen or both?
This should be interesting so iI can prepare for a different world.
Comment
15 of 22
Anonymous
October 27, 2011
For comment 15 by vasuki
Buyer beware make sure you by the panles with either 3 or 5 year warranty; check minium buy quanity; make sure you can find stateside installer and make sure you can get home owners insurance to cover your house with cheap panels and fianlly who services panels in the US; make sure you can find correct invertors and battry packs with same criteria.
Good luck and warn your neighbors and check with local power company about grid tie back
I think the number people are waiting for is $1/W installed for the PV system, not $1/W wholesale PV module cost. For utility scale PV we are still bounded by about $2.50/W installed on the lower end using thin film modules.
It's really not cost per watt that counts though, that's just an easy to understand number to throw around that reflects the upfront cost. The real number is LCOE which is the cost of energy produced over the life of the system taking many things into account and is hard to quantify if you are not versed in the financial side of things. Remember that it's energy produced that really counts. If I can install a PV system for $0.05/W in a cave does that really matter?
My biggest fears for solar is that they continue to use the chemical elements they are using to produce electricity via PV. It is obvious that there is a significant shortage of those elements, so, unless the NREL comes up with Nitrate based systems, there will be a remarkably short quantity of solar PV available except for thin film varieties. It means a lot for someone who wants long term performance and supply, since thin film in my own environment shows it has a 2 year life cycle of operation as all my yard lights have lost capacity to recharge their batteries, and the batteries have suffered significant degradation, which would also show in aluminum structures meant to secure PV.
CSP (Concentrated Solar Power) then is the best hope for Untility grade solar until Hydrolysis Hybrid systems can create Hydrogen Fuel Cell generators and Solar CSP or PV to enable the system to continue to have sufficient capacity to run 24/7.
I therefore see Solar PV to experience a split between superior quality of efficiencies, versus superior quantity of availability and longevity in thin film, that can survive wet, humid air in the southern USA, and still generate beyond the 20 year level, that currently looks unlikely from field tests. So with the great need for land area for CSP, is it viable for places like Hawaii? What places are available that do not have vegetation? I want solar to survive, but Solar needs new reactive materials to exist long term. Else, the USA will never make it into the Solar camps, as limited access equates to higher prices. It isn't that hard to see the dangers coming our way.
In response to my earlier statement, I believe solar will cause more job losses than gains because:
1. Solar is more automation/robotics friendly at manufacturing sites than Coal/Hydrothermal.
2. Solar installation jobs are too short-term to sustain a 25 year sustainable replacement cycle.
3. Maintenance is very simple and will not support many full-time positions.
4. The system requires minimal overhead compared to other systems.
I see more disruptions to steady employment due to boom/bust cycles of system installations. Also, I see unexpected demand for installations due to natural disasters such as earthquakes, tornados, etc.. Consequently, causing down time due to delayed replacement and mothballed diesel back-ups.
The fact that solar energy requires least maintenance should be viewed as an advantage and not a handicap. If people can generate most of the energy demands at home with minimal maintenance, it is much better than digging up fossil fuels which pollute the earth and adversely affect the health and change the climate for many many centuries.
I appreciate the comments of Phil and Larry, The cave man story was a good one. Anonymous, I understand why you remain anonymous, It is a good idea not to let folks know which asylum you come from. Solar's future is bright.
Sustainable employment and new (non-cannabalizing)industries are some of the key factors to stability. If these two things are not supported then people may ask how will they pay off their loans. Conversely, a national resource allocation dividend paid to all citizens can raise awareness of the need to move toward recycling and renewable resources. Currently, a similar move has been taken by the state of Alaska. The residents of that northern state get paid for living there and the money comes from oil. Why not do something similar with solar and other sources of electricity?
Land, sea, air, and even space transportation can stand to benefit from using electricity to move people and goods.
'anonymous, I understand why you remain anonymous, It is a good idea not to let folks know which asylum you come from. Solar's future is bright.'
A bit harsh aren't we?
Ever been on a right wing blog site? This is mild in comparison.
Although Anonymous obviously cannot spell and has severe difficulty in stringing more than three words together to form some sort of a sentence,at least it's not clear yet that he has entered another dimension of time and space. That he is not embracing the dogma and spin developed by right wing moron's that serve as red meat to their mindless minions.
On second thought I suppose I cannot assume that since most of what he posted had form but served no function in conveying any message. So perhaps he was saying the same things that can read on right wing blogs.
I suppose the true meaning behind his 'message' will have to remain a mystery. You don't suppose someone invented a time machine and went back and installed an IP address at Conservanon's cave do you? Hmmmmmm!
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I am an associate editor for Power Engineering magazine. I cover EPA's regulations for the power industry in detail. When it comes to renewables, I write regula...
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