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Does the Wild West of Solar Sales Need Taming?

By Timothee Neron-Bancel
April 14, 2011   |   12 Comments

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12 Reader Comments
Comment
1 of 12
April 14, 2011
Tim, I am a little consfused as to your roll in NABCEP.
The first thing everyone should do when considering using a NABCEP certified installer is to go to the NABCEP website and read their disclaimer at the bottom of their home page. I've posted this time and time again. Here it is:

NABCEP certification is not a professional license issued by a government agency, and does not authorize a certificant to practice. NABCEP certificants must comply with all legal requirements related to practice, including licensing laws

If this it true than there is some contridiction with your motives.

So until they become a true certification entity, any training they give does not mean squat. In my mind, it is just another scheme to keep consumers from believing that those already educated and qualified people are somehow not qualified, according to some invaliid certification This just seems like it is another attack on the promotion of renewables.
Comment
2 of 12
April 14, 2011
Hi Thomas,
My role at NABCEP is to maintain and help develop NABCEP's credentials for renewable energy practitioners. I am glad that you put the disclaimer up again and that you are familiar with it. There is nothing in that disclaimer that is incorrect or that in any way devalues the certifications that NABCEP offers. Certifications are not intended to act as licenses or enable individuals to perform a job. We are absolutely committed to the notion that our credentials do not supersede local regulations regarding trade qualifications or licensure and to that end require that all certificants sign a code of ethics and standard of conduct in which they agree to adhere to all local regulations.

What our certifications offer is a valuable tool for consumers and policy makers to identify individuals who have demonstrated specific knowledge about their area of work, be it PV, Solar Thermal or Small Wind. The focus of my article is that specifically for a job like solar sales, certification is very important since it sets the bar for best practices and promotes the qualified workforce.

Finally, I'm not quite sure what you mean about a "true certification". NABCEP operates all of its programs in accordance to ISO/ANSI 17024, a set of internationally recognized standards for personnel certification. In fact, our PV Installer Certification is accredited by ANSI, the American National Standards Institute, to the 17024 standard
Comment
3 of 12
April 14, 2011
Sure, you may be accredited, but the certification, once again according to the disclaimer, does not authorize a certificant to practice.
EG. I read a book on brain surgery and familiarize myself with all the tools involved and I get credit from someone for the knowledge I've gained. It still doesn't give me the true qualifications to do a lobotomy.
So if consumers believe your accredations, and believe an installer must have your accredidations to do a job, that leaves the experienced installers out of the picture and the consumer will hire a person who has simply read a book or users manual or was taught in the clssroom about RE for which they recieved credit. It does not give them real world experience which in turn can make for bad installations.
Comment
4 of 12
April 15, 2011
I think Timothee is advocating BOTH experience AND qualification which is measured by passing a NABCEP exam. The first thing I mentioned to prospective customers when I was in sales was that my installer was NABCEP certified and had many years of installation experience. I explained what that meant and asked them to ask the other salesfolk if their installer was NABCEP certified. I made a lot of sales in a competitive market. I recently passed the entry level NABCEP exam and will take the PV Technical Sales Exam in the near future. Don't any of you other salespeople take the exam because I want to have the advantage over you (experience, certification and incredible attractiveness).
Comment
5 of 12
April 16, 2011
Luke, yes you are right the combination of experience and education, not necessarily certification, should be on every installers agenda. I have lost jobs due to customers asking if I am NABCEP certified due to their own ignorance. I have had graduate level courses at my local university on PV and I am sure that these courses cover PV analysis far more deeper than any cerification that NABCEP offers. If you look at their curriculum, most certification classes are run by reps of companies pushing their products and are at best only a few hours long to learn some basics. Other classes they offer are based on teachings that any educated person can achieve by just reading the operation and installation manuals,(if they are written correctly). And once again, read their disclaimer, they are not accredited in any way. If you are the one telling customers that your installers are competent and you are overseeing their work, that makes you the one responsible. So if anything goes wrong, who is to blame? You cannot blame NABCEP because they do not take on the responsibility. The customer cannot make a claim to their insurance company if their roof leaks or catches fire by proposing that their installer wss supposedly trained and accredited by an entity that claims their accreditaion means squat.
You say you are an experienced salesman. Do you feel that your salesmanship is better because you took one of their classes? If so, great, but do you think, after taking the class, that you felt much different about yourself and your knowledge than when you first sat down in the classroom? Did they teach you anything new that you didn't already know? If so, then maybe you were not qualified to begin with.
Most of my business is in SHW. I don't think that any class they give will compare to my 30 years experiece working in construction, and as a licensed plumber, as well as my knowledge as a Mechanical Engineer, would have any effect on what I am capable of doing.
Comment
6 of 12
April 16, 2011
thomas,

I'm actually in a 2 year Associate of Appled Science Renewable Energy degree program at a community college (will finish in June). The NABCEP Exam that I took is part of the program. The instructors have many years of experience in the solar field and are excellent. One owns a sustainable products store in town and has been involved in solar for over 30 years and one is the technical editor for SolarPro magazine and author of Solar PV Design and Installation for Dummies. I worked in the solar industry for a total of 5 1/2 years before I started this program and I've learned a lot more about solar and am very glad I went through the program even at my advanced age. For 3 of the 5 1/2 years, I sold PV and sold over a $million worth of PV systems/year so, yes, I'd consider myself knowledgable before the program. The way I measure my success is not in dollars though. It's measured by the rave reviews I got from customers for jobs well done. They actually called my employer and told him what a great job me, my project manager and installation crew did and what nice and knowledgable guys we all were.

It sounds like you could breeze through the NABCEP Exam with your experience so you should consider taking it and stop losing jobs to folks that have. Don't be offended, I'm trying to help. I respect your many years of experience but you might want to try being more positive. The tone of your posts are a little negative and that will just work against you in relationships. Just a thought. Good luck.
Comment
7 of 12
April 16, 2011
Yes Luke, once again I agree with you. Education is important and the staff you mention, sounds like you can learn things from them. But I am not going to waste my time or money on a program that is obsolete when it comes to qualification.
And when customers refuse my or others service because of NABCEP it is them who is losing out. I always refer them back to the NABCEP site and try to educate them as to the invalid claims they make. This program, in my opinion, which may mean squat also, hurts more than it heals with it's false claims and keeps already knowledgable and experience installers out of the loop by brainwashing ignorant consumers.
Also where have all the other certification programs from the past gone? And are their certificates still worth something?
As far as the tone of my posts, most posters here, and other places, who have years of experience in the field understand my point of view and my desire to do what is right rather than do what I am told by some politician, lawmaker, policy, fly by night certification school, 1-5 year bandwagon veteran of solar or inexperieced installer.
Comment
8 of 12
April 16, 2011
thomas,

The installer I worked with has been an electrician for over 30 years. He's C20, C46, A1, etc., etc. classified. He's also NABCEP certified, which gives him a leg up on the competition. Tools are important in the construction industry, as you well know. NABCEP is a tool that opens doors.

Also, as you well know, solar (thermal) got a black eye in the past from the fly-by-nights that you mentioned. NABCEP is a certification program that at least attempts to weed out those that are not knowledgable. It's a step in the right direction.

I started with SolaHart units in 1978 but gave it up because we were in the middle of one of the numerous recessions we seem to be having and it was a hard sell. Customers are much more informed these days (your job is to inform them if they're not) and see the benefits of solar. It saves energy costs in the long run as well as being clean.

I worked as an air quality tech for 10 years (tough job). I also worked hard on organic farms for 10 years. Worked hard in the construction industry for 3 years. Received a BA in biological sciences degree. Am about to receive an AAS degree in renewable energy. Research diver for a year. Maintenance, installation and repair diver for 3 years and many other odd jobs. I'm willing to do whatever it takes to get ahead.
Comment
9 of 12
April 19, 2011
I have a 2-year A.A.S. in Renewable Energy with an emphasis on PV installation and design. I think NABCEP is a fine organization.
Comment
10 of 12
April 19, 2011
NABCEP is w/o a doubt very necessary and i think NABCEP has to reach consumers as well to educate them in this very "Wild West" field (from the consumer view). I doubt you could pass any NABCEP test just by reading a book. Good training and experience are a must. I do question, and know respected instructors that do as well, why NABCEP doesn't separate out battery based system knowledge testing from grid tie knowledge testing. They are quite different markets and 90% of integrators will never be installing one.
Comment
11 of 12
April 22, 2011
Goldray, if you question why they do not push or educate people for off grid systems, that should be your first question you should get answered. What is their real agenda? That should be the next question you should ask. Who is behind the schooling and why do they only push what they want to push. Why don't they want to educate about energy independence? (eg battery based systems)
Every other trade requires not only schooling, but years of field and work experience, apprenticeship, and then testing. Maybe if they start installing bad products and do bad installations, because that is what they are taught by uncertified, unqualified schooling, then they make solar look bad and we're back to oil, again!
I am not totally against what NABCEP is trying to do, but education is a tricky thing when it comes to actual true knowledge and the liability it comes with.
Comment
12 of 12
July 5, 2011
NABCEP is the most credible, recognized certification body for PV professionals in North America. This is why there is a growing demand for a NABCEP presence in Canada, so that the PV Installer, PV Technical Sales and other certifications can be obtained according to the Canadian Electrical Code. PV is in a tough fight against nuclear and fossil fuel supporters north of the border, and professionalizing the industry is sorely needed to ensure consumer protection and sustainable development of the industry.
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